Low-probability/High-consequence Wet Exits

[leong]

Years ago a failed roll (with the sprayskirt’s grab loop tucked under) nearly finished me off. That incident made me a believer in sprayskirts that have a safety strap across the deck. That way, even if the grab loop breaks loose (or is unintentionally tucked under) you still have an easy way to release the sprayskirt. But there still is the potential for a problem. For instance:

1. You can’t locate the grab loop and the safety strap could rip free from the force of pulling on it while upside down.
2. You can’t locate the grab loop and your safety strap could unintentionally be looped under the sprayskirt.
3. You may forget to reach for the safety strap if you can’t locate the grab loop.

Yesterday, the third situation occurred as a friend failed a practice roll. Thankfully, I was close enough to perform a successful Eskimo bow rescue.

Today I connected a 1/4-inch nylon line between my grab loop and the safety strap. I think this will reduce the chances of mistakenly tucking the grab loop inside the kayak cockpit or unintentionally looping the safety strap under the sprayskirt (the latter once happened to me). Also, if the safety strap or the grab loop breaks free the line can be used to release the sprayskirt.

Nevertheless, it’s a good idea to practice removing your sprayskirt without using the grab loop or safety strap. Also, it’s a good idea to practice staying in the boat and rat swimming to the surface awaiting a bow rescue or to attempt another roll.

Anyone have any comments or better “belt and suspenders” ideas for this topic?

-Leon

PS
I was using a very tight white-water style sprayskirt when I failed the roll mentioned above. Panic was setting in as I ran out of air and I nearly broke off some fingers when I placed them underneath the edge of the sprayskirt to pull it off. My paddle was about 100 feet away, stored on a dinghy, because I was practicing hand rolls.

Edited August 8, 2014 by leong

[Dan Foster]

Some time when you KNOW your grab loop is available, and you have help standing by, practice releasing your skirt without the loop or strap. Mine comes off if I grab a handful near my hip - there's less tension in the spray deck there than up by my knees. You can also try punching your fist down through the spray deck to try to implode the sides of the skirt. I have a plastic boat, so the coaming is less grippy.

A few times after practicing rolls, I've found that my grab loop ends up under the first bungee line across my bow deck. I may tie it forward to reduce the chance of it getting in the way of a release.

Have you practiced reaching back to grab one of your spare paddle halves, and doing a broken paddle roll?

[billvoss]

My personal worst wet exit was a few years ago in my white-water kayak with a group practicing rolling in current. It was near the end of the day, I was very tired, and I missed my roll, and my next roll, ... and somewhere in there my kayak went into fairly shallow rocky water and my paddle was ripped from my hands.

I tried to reach forward to grab my spray skirt loop, and instead my helmet hit the bottom. The water was too shallow for me to lean forward and reach the loop! I then released an edge of the skirt. I pushed down on the kayak for my now very urgent wet exit, which required more force than usual. Part way out of the kayak my feet felt tangled, and I struggled momentarily to kick them free. Then AIR, wonderful AIR.

Very shortly after my wet exit one of the safety boaters confirmed I was OK, and fetched my kayak. When they flipped my kayak upright, they were very surprised to see my skirt still attached! One side was partly released, but that tight white-water skirt was still hanging onto the kayak!

Anyone have any comments or better “belt and suspenders” ideas for this topic?

I also own a spray skirt with suspenders, a fabric tunnel, and a neoprene deck. Fortunately you can take the suspenders off, because I will NOT take that skirt on the water with suspenders attached!

When I help out with the NH AMC White Water School I first make students show me they can pop their skirt with the loop, and then show me they can pop their skirt without the loop! I also usually tell them the story of leaving my skirt behind.

[BethS]

I've found that i can pop my sprayskirt off without using my hands at all if I bend one leg up out from under the front deck, and simply push hard as if i were standing up in the cockpit. However this only works if you have a keyhole cockpit that you can get one knee out of while you are still sitting in the boat.

[rfolster]

I don't know how to avoid Bill's situation, but can avoid Leon's. When putting on my spray skirt, I hook the back, then slide my hands along the sides up towards the front. As I go to hook the front, I give it a quick flip to get the loop on top of the skirt. It is a single motion of flip-and-hook, and if I don't see the loop, I take a half second to do the flip-and-hook again to make sure the loop is out. Then, throughout the remainder of the day, I always make sure that the loop is free and accessible, especially after stowing my chart case under the bungees.

Secondly, I always keep a spare paddle within reach. I had an incident this past weekend during a training where the release button on my split paddle got caught on a bungee line, so I need to make sure that 1) I have a spare paddle with me 2) I can reach it from the cockpit and now 3) that I can actually get it out! Need to go shopping for a set of paddle britches.

I think the point I am trying to make is that, instead of trying to reinvent the wheel with a makeshift piece of rope that can get snagged during T-rescues or something like that, consider first an improvement to how you use what you currently have.

By the way, one of the scenarios you presented is if the loop should tear off. If it does, having the rope doesn't help you pull the front of the skirt off, and you now have a rope swirling under water waiting to wrap around your arms or your neck. I have recently heard the saying "If your equipment is not helping you, it is trying to kill you." It has really made me start thinking about what I have and how I use it.

[EEL]

"If your equipment is not helping you, it is trying to kill you."

And the more stuff you have, the more potential assassins you have.

I think it also implies gear that is simple and effective.

Ed Lawson

[rick stoehrer]

i would not attach that line to the grab loop as the potential for it to snag and tangle on something is much greater than the potential of me;

1. burying the grab loop and

2, not being able to pinch the deck off from the side

rob and ed said it...simple is better. methodology for putting the skirt on correctly shouldn't waiver...it's habit. like putting on pants - start at the back, come around and end with that grab loop accessible. always. guessing you won't forget this experience for awhile.

i hear what you're saying about a tight spray deck but so far i've not met one i couldn't grab with both hands at the side and pull off the coaming. another handy thing to test beforehand.

...and you were practicing hand rolls with your paddle far away AND you neglected to square away the grab loop? hell leon, why didn't you really challenge yourself and stuff some hamburg into your pfd pockets and chum the water?

paging mr darwin, a mr. c. darwin? no? guess you just missed him.

[bbjorn]

A bunch of years ago while in over my head surfing some six-footers I got seriously maytagged, blew my roll, and went to pop my skirt but couldn't find the grab loop. It was November, I was wearing thick neoprene gloves, and suddenly realized that I had no tactile sensation to feel the loop. Lucky for me, I had practiced releasing the skirt from the side. But limited dexterity with thick gloves was making it very tough to pinch-grip the edge. So I tried pulling off a glove but they were wet on the inside and that was impossible. I was pretty much out of options and beginning to panic. I tried again to release the skirt from the side and after several more increasingly frantic efforts with fingers slipping off, finally got it.

Since that "near miss" I've been a crusader for having every new paddler practice releasing the skirt WITHOUT the grab loop, in as many ways as possble.

That incident also drilled into me that anytime I add anything new to my pfd, deck, or dress I need to include it when practicing self-rescues. Winter gloves made something I'd practiced much harder and could have made for a bad outcome. Down at my local pond recently testing a new pfd, I discovered the different pocket configuration was causing my cowboy to fail . Turns out that anything bulky, like a radio, in the right front pocket of my pfd makes a cowboy nearly impossible.

After that surfing incident I attached a small hard rubber ball to my grab loop. Looks dorky as hell but it serves two purposes. It makes it more obvious when the loop is tucked under the skirt. And it makes it much easier to find the grab loop, especially when wearing winter gloves. I'm also considering adding a small pull tap to each side of the skirt, something I can grip with gloves but small enough to minimize the entaglement hazard.

[jason]

[text deleted]

After that surfing incident I attached a small hard rubber ball to my grab loop. Looks dorky as hell but it serves two purposes. It makes it more obvious when the loop is tucked under the skirt. And it makes it much easier to find the grab loop, especially when wearing winter gloves. I'm also considering adding a small pull tap to each side of the skirt, something I can grip with gloves but small enough to minimize the entaglement hazard.

I would be careful with adding anything to the grab loop. The balls/objects added can become a real hazard. Whe the skirt is undone and the grab loop is in the boat these items can get caught under the front edge of the seat and trap you in the boat.

Practicing removing the skit from the side is a great thing, but I wouldn't add anything to the grab loop.

[Michael_Crouse]

I would be careful with adding anything to the grab loop. The balls/objects added can become a real hazard. Whe the skirt is undone and the grab loop is in the boat these items can get caught under the front edge of the seat and trap you in the boat.

Practicing removing the skit from the side is a great thing, but I wouldn't add anything to the grab loop.

There was a shop who would attach practice golf balls to the grab loops of spray skirts, I suspect they would easily collapse if they were stuck and you yanked on them...... unlike the giant biner I keep on my grab loop..... ducking for cover from the flames

[EEL]

Jason:

"Practicing removing the skit from the side is a great thing"

My first reaction to all this is "Doesn't everyone do this?" as in practicing without using the stupid loop and how hard can it be to wet exit regardless of the stupid loop, but upon reflection I realized we all get lazy and don't do the simple things as often as we should. The fact some good and experienced paddlers have reflected here upon needing to wet exit when the stupid loop was not readily available suggests it is not good to forget to practice simple stuff.

Ed Lawson

[leong]

Okay, I was expecting NSPN shark attacks and they sure did arrive. Here’s what I have to say:

>>I've found that i can pop my sprayskirt off without using my hands at all if I bend one leg up out from under the front deck, and simply push hard as if i were standing up in the cockpit.

Sometimes you might panic and not do it. The person in my post didn’t do it. Besides, the safety strap was there and it wasn’t used.

>>When putting on my spray skirt, I hook the back, then slide my hands along the sides up towards the front. As I go to hook the front, I give it a quick flip to get the loop on top of the skirt. It is a single motion of flip-and-hook, and if I don't see the loop, I take a half second to do the flip-and-hook again to make sure the loop is out.

Obviously, most of us do it that way. But sometimes in a hurry we may forget. Or the grab loop can break off in a combat situation.

>>Secondly, I always keep a spare paddle within reach.

First you have to know how to roll with half of a paddle. Considering you failed your roll with your favorite paddle what’s the chance you’ll have enough time to reach back and do a successful roll with half of your spare paddle? Perhaps you capsized in a breaker (or in the rocks) and have little air left and can’t take the time to find another paddle.

I can only hold my breath for about a minute before my lungs start to scream. In a panic situation I can’t hold out that long. In fact, as what happened to my friend in my post is that the panic set in as soon as it was noticed that the grab loop wasn’t there. That’s practice, not theory. An axiom in science is to believe practice over theory. Rare “Black Swan” events with severe consequences happen more often then you think. And if the risk is death and the safety precaution is trivial then you might want to consider that precaution. But to each his own.

>>I think the point I am trying to make is that, instead of trying to reinvent the wheel with a makeshift piece of rope that can get snagged during T-rescues or something like that, consider first an improvement to how you use what you currently have.

Oh, like improving your driving skill instead putting up with inconvenient seat belts.

I played with the rope about a dozen times today. I don’t think that it’s any more probable to snag than the built in “safety strap” that SnapDragon installs on some of their sprayskirt models. Take a close look at the picture and figure out how and what I can snag it on. The rope is about 6” long. It “ain’t” going to swirl around and wrap around anything. I think that it’s more probable that your sprayskirt would come loose and ride up to your neck and choke you. Oops, anyone wanna buy my sprayskirt.

Obviously you should practice everything. But I guarantee you that you’ll be a swimmer some day and not follow what you practiced. Black Swan mistakes do happen.

>>…By the way, one of the scenarios you presented is if the loop should tear off. If it does, having the rope doesn't help you pull the front of the skirt off.

But since it’s attached to the safety strap when you pull the rope it will pull the sprayskirt off from the side.

BTW, as I proved to myself today in Salem Bay, the real advantage of the rope is that you almost can’t attach the front of the sprayskirt with the grab loop tucked under. The thickness of the rope holds the sprayskirt bead up too high to attach the sprayskirt properly. And that my friend is the real purpose of the short rope. Of course, it probably requires using a sprayskirt with a safety strap. My rope solution is, as Pru said to me today, “… like two belts and suspenders”.

>>And the more stuff you have, the more potential assassins you have.

Sure Ed, don’t carry a spare paddle, a VHF, a compass, a GPS, etc. When you drive disconnect your seatbelt … there are documented cases where the seatbelt has killed someone.

>>methodology for putting the skirt on correctly shouldn't waiver...it's habit. like putting on pants - start at the back, come around and end with that grab loop accessible. always. guessing you won't forget this experience for awhile.

I have no idea whether the person that I bow rescued that day did it that way or not. When it happened to me personally (about 12 years ago) I failed a long series of attempted hand rolls. Apparently I got sloppy on the last try. I know you find it hard to believe, but even Leon makes an occasional mistake.

The 20-cent piece of rope might save someone’s butt from that rare occurrence. That’s the reason for my post. And the enjoyment of the shark attacks too.

>>i hear what you're saying about a tight spray deck but so far i've not met one i couldn't grab with both hands at the side and pull off the coaming. another handy thing to test beforehand.

I have no idea whether my friend had practiced that or not. But the point is that the person panicked for whatever reason. Even though the safety strap was there but not used.

>>...and you were practicing hand rolls with your paddle far away AND you neglected to square away the grab loop? hell leon, why didn't you really challenge yourself and stuff some hamburg into your pfd pockets and chum the water?

Come on, Rick, you, if anyone, surely know what it’s like to be Rambo! It’s a lonely club for cats like us.

>>paging mr darwin, a mr. c. darwin? no? guess you just missed him.

Ya got me on that one. Score one for the younger Rambo.

But seriously, the point of my post had nothing to do with my failed hand roll and difficulty in wet exiting. I mentioning that incident only because that’s when I converted to using sprayskirts with safety straps. The point of the post is that a person can panic when they don’s see the grab loop. My short piece of rope connected between the grab loop and the safety strap almost completely eliminates that potential panic situation.

Respectfully,

CAM-able Leon

[bbjorn]

I would be careful with adding anything to the grab loop. The balls/objects added can become a real hazard. Whe the skirt is undone and the grab loop is in the boat these items can get caught under the front edge of the seat and trap you in the boat.

Very important advice, Jason, and something I keep in mind whenever I attach something to my pfd or boat. The ball I added to the grab loop is 2 in. in diameter and I tested it all around the cockpit. I could not find any way for it to get hung up. Of course, that's no guarantee so I have a sharp knife on my pfd as a backup.

[billvoss]

Though it would not solve my scenario, the SkirtworkS Quick Grab Ripcord is a grab loop alternative designed to always be on the outside of the skirt. Basically instead of just sewing a loop of webbing to the front of the skirt, Skirtworks sews one end of the webbing to the front of the skirt, covers the webbing with tubing, then sews the other end of the webbing a few inches in from the end of the skirt.

I have not owned one, but I have paddled with white-water paddlers who love the design. I suspect that like Leon's thick rope, the tubing might also make it impossible, or at least difficult, to install the skirt upside down. It sure looks like the tubing and fixed location should make it much easier to find the loop. This loop never gets tucked under, never gets stuck under deck bungee, never floats to some strange angle, and has some heft you can probably feel with gloves. The webbing is also attached to the skirt in two places, not just one, which probably makes a "total" grab loop failure less likely.

They also offer custom skirts. I'll bet they would be willing to add their Quick Grab Ripcord not just to the front, but also to the back or side(s) of the skirt for the truly paranoid!

[rick stoehrer]

In my experience...that line between John Rambo and Forrest Gump sure can be fuzzy and boy don't it sneak right up on you?

Still trying to color within the lines...

[prudenceb]

The good thing about these posts is that they can inspire whole groups of people to think about things they probably shoulda thought of but hadn't... Like practicing wet exits popping off the sprayskirt without using the grab loop. And so it was this afternoon that half of the paddlers on today's Gerrish Island trip amused the gawking party boaters behind the breakwater by first doing some rolls and then wet exiting pulling off our sprayskirts sans grab loops. One person realized it would be hard to do wearing gloves...food for thought. Another found that just pushing up with her knees worked. I found it easy enough to pull up the skirt from the side but then experienced that only half the skirt detached from the cockpit and while I was halfway out had to reach forward to fully free myself.

I think we all found it a useful exercise. I will now add periodic practices to my Walden Pond repertoire.

Thanks, Leon, for raising the issue...sharks and all!

pru

[leong]

Though it would not solve my scenario, the SkirtworkS Quick Grab Ripcord is a grab loop alternative designed to always be on the outside of the skirt. Basically instead of just sewing a loop of webbing to the front of the skirt, Skirtworks sews one end of the webbing to the front of the skirt, covers the webbing with tubing, then sews the other end of the webbing a few inches in from the end of the skirt.

I have not owned one, but I have paddled with white-water paddlers who love the design. I suspect that like Leon's thick rope, the tubing might also make it impossible, or at least difficult, to install the skirt upside down. It sure looks like the tubing and fixed location should make it much easier to find the loop. This loop never gets tucked under, never gets stuck under deck bungee, never floats to some strange angle, and has some heft you can probably feel with gloves. The webbing is also attached to the skirt in two places, not just one, which probably makes a "total" grab loop failure less likely.

They also offer custom skirts. I'll bet they would be willing to add their Quick Grab Ripcord not just to the front, but also to the back or side(s) of the skirt for the truly paranoid!

Bill,

Thanks! I like the design of that SkirtworkS sprayskirt. Finally, a commercial company designed a much safer sprayskirt. In theory, I think that their design legitimizes my concept of adding the rope to my sprayskirt. But I like having a safety strap as well. Besides the safety aspect I like that I can slip my water bottle under the strap.

-Leon

[EEL]

In my experience...that line between John Rambo and Forrest Gump sure can be fuzzy

Hmmm...I wonder if those folks who use a akullisaq and/or tuilik neither of which have a grab loop as such are Rambos or Gumps. Maybe both.

Ed Lawson

Edited August 9, 2014 by EEL

[leong]

The good thing about these posts is that they can inspire whole groups of people to think about things they probably shoulda thought of but hadn't... Like practicing wet exits popping off the sprayskirt without using the grab loop. And so it was this afternoon that half of the paddlers on today's Gerrish Island trip amused the gawking party boaters behind the breakwater by first doing some rolls and then wet exiting pulling off our sprayskirts sans grab loops. One person realized it would be hard to do wearing gloves...food for thought. Another found that just pushing up with her knees worked. I found it easy enough to pull up the skirt from the side but then experienced that only half the skirt detached from the cockpit and while I was halfway out had to reach forward to fully free myself.

I think we all found it a useful exercise. I will now add periodic practices to my Walden Pond repertoire.

Thanks, Leon, for raising the issue...sharks and all!

pru

Thanks, Pru.

The practice session was a very good idea. At least it shows what you can and cannot do under ideal conditions. It helps get the proper moves into “muscle memory”.

I’m sure you realize that a successful sprayskirt release without a grab loop under combat conditions might be much harder to achieve. The main difference is psychological. The technique is identical, but the shock of suddenly capsizing in cold, rough water out at sea can make it seem more difficult. Everyone gets a little nervous and some might panic. That’s why I’m interested in more robust ways for releasing a sprayskirt.

-Leon

[Gcosloy]

I like my Seals sprayskirt which has small loops two on each side sewn into the neoprene so you can remove the skirt from the sides without having to get your fingers under the bungee.

[EEL]

While not an alternative method for releasing a spraydeck, nobody has mentioned another commonly taught preventative technique which is that everyone should be looking about and checking if others have properly affixed their spraydeck.

Ed Lawson

[leong]

everyone should be looking about and checking if others have properly affixed their spraydeck.

Ed Lawson

Definitely!!!

[leong]

I like my Seals sprayskirt which has small loops two on each side sewn into the neoprene so you can remove the skirt from the sides without having to get your fingers under the bungee.

Gene,

I couldn’t find a picture of the model you have with the loops. But since I’ve seen yours I have this to say:

I think the little loops are way too small for their intended purpose. Especially if you are wearing gloves and trying to get a finger inside the loop to pull on it.

Separately, while looking for a picture, I found this review of sprayskirts. For the "Seals Extreme Tour Spray Skirt" it says the following which is very pertinent to the topic of this thread:

The deck of the skirt actually matched the shape of my cockpit. The heavy duty bungee cord snapped into place with authority. Seals recommends that you put the skirt on your cockpit for 24 hours prior to use to stretch the skirt some. I forgot to do that. I tested releasing the skirt with the grab loop and found that it took considerable force and proper technique to release this skirt. You would not be able to release this skirt if you improperly just tried to pull back on the grab loop. It just wouldn't come off. The skirt was very difficult to get off grabbing at the sides of the deck instead of the grab loop. If you failed to keep the grab loop outside the skirt as it should always be, you could be in serious difficult getting out of the boat. The super strong bungee, tight shaping, sticky material that keeps this skirt tight on the cockpit might prevent an exit from the boat without proper procedure and technique. Therefore this skirt is not appropriate for the beginner whose skills in wet exits are suspect.

I don't think this is the model you have.

-Leon

[Gcosloy]

Here is a picture showing the side loops: http://www.sealsskirts.com/prod_detect.php?i=13

I've never had a problem grabbing these loops. However the review you quote needs to be qualified: Was the recommended size being used for his cockpit. I use a 1.4 for both a Romany and Explorer which Seals however lists as a custom-so maybe if I tried their custom for those boats I too might find it tight. Anyway good discussion-now everyone who reads this will want to practice getting their skirt off from the sides as well as the front. Leon-you've done a mitzvah!

[bbjorn]

Though it would not solve my scenario, the SkirtworkS Quick Grab Ripcord is a grab loop alternative designed to always be on the outside of the skirt. Basically instead of just sewing a loop of webbing to the front of the skirt, Skirtworks sews one end of the webbing to the front of the skirt, covers the webbing with tubing, then sews the other end of the webbing a few inches in from the end of the skirt.

Bill -- thanks for the tip. My sprayskirt is 7 years old, patched, glued, and badly needing replacement and I'm seriously considering this one. Could be a great solution for those of us who've learned how easy it is to get into trouble in this critical area.

Blaine