Rescuing Swimmers ??

[chetpk]

Last night at the Hampton Surf sessions, our pod of paddlers heading out under the Hampton-Seabrook Bridge we encountered a small child (2nd-3rd grade age?) and an adult (mom?) who had gotten into the current and the child had gone into full panic mode. Initially I think most of us didn't read the potential severity of the event, but soon did and immediately paddled to them. The young child grabbed the first boat within her reach and immediately tried to and eventually succeeded to climb up on the deck of that boat. She was beyond the state of being willing to simply hold onto the boat and be allowed to be paddled in. Here is what I remembered and noticed.

1. The child being in full panic mode made the first boat to her quite unstable and almost flipped it on several occasions.

2. The original rescue boat in its' attempts to stabilize itself with bracing almost struck the girls head with the paddle (no fault of the paddler) and we all know how potent the edge of a paddle could be.

3. The adult was holding onto the other end of the original rescue boat, but stayed in the water and didn't appear to be adding to the situation at that point in time creating greater chaos.

4. Once a number of us understood that the event in front of required kayak rescuing skills, they began to take hold.

What did I take away from this?

1. The need to recognize what is going on around you even if it isn't directly involving people from your group.

2. Don't panic.

3. The importance of a second - third etc. boat to come along side the first boat and have people lay across the deck of the first boat as quickly as possible to stabilize it.

4. Do your best to keep the swimmers informed with what they need to do. The adult did appear to listen, the child out of sheer fear and panic did not.

5. The adult upon my directions let go of the first boat and grabbed the stern of mine allowing me to tow them in.

Questions I have are ??

1. If you were a solo paddler or others in your pod were not so close to you during such an event, how do you stabilize your boat and prevent being capsized by a panicked person in the water?

2. A paddle's edge being used rapidly to scull or brace could be a pretty lethal weapon on a panicking swimmer so how do you use it without endangering the person in the water?

3. Is there a specific person who should be taking charge and giving directions?

4. What else should be done different or looked at from another point of view?

I was appalled at the treatment of the child (who did spit up some water) by the adult after it was all over, but that is another story.

[Phil Allen]

Good of you (all) for being in the right place in the right time. Can't answer all your questions but just wanted to point out that in any rescue circumstance, you are the person to take care of first, then the rest of the group and last the person who needs rescue. If the panicked swimmer is going to put you in danger, the best course of action is to wait until they're more manageable.

Phil

[tyson]

In addition to 2nd-ing Phil's comments, and in the spirit of don't become a victim yourself:

A sculling brace can be VERY powerful. Used effectively, it is (nearly?) impossible for a swimmer to capsize a kayak, even if their purpose is to do so. The exception would be if the swimmer gets a hold on the paddle.

Don't let them grab your paddle, and if they get whacked because you are defending yourself against their "assault", so be it. If needed, whack them deliberately.

[eneumeier]

Pause, assess the situation, make a plan that includes protecting yourself, then approach.

I seriously doubt that any words would calm a panicked child. So, approaching with a support boat in place might be the best option. Sometimes "distraction" can help: Ask "what is your favorite movie?"

(I think most people would have trouble hitting a panicked child with a paddle. Hitting Bob Burnett with a paddle, back in the day, on the other hand was great fun!)

Good job! The best rescue is one that works. Your's did!

Liz

[Doug]

Last night at the Hampton Surf sessions, our pod of paddlers heading out under the Hampton-Seabrook Bridge we encountered a small child (2nd-3rd grade age?) and an adult (mom?) who had gotten into the current and the child had gone into full panic mode. Initially I think most of us didn't read the potential severity of the event, but soon did and immediately paddled to them. The young child grabbed the first boat within her reach and immediately tried to and eventually succeeded to climb up on the deck of that boat. She was beyond the state of being willing to simply hold onto the boat and be allowed to be paddled in. Here is what I remembered and noticed.

1. The child being in full panic mode made the first boat to her quite unstable and almost flipped it on several occasions.

2. The original rescue boat in its' attempts to stabilize itself with bracing almost struck the girls head with the paddle (no fault of the paddler) and we all know how potent the edge of a paddle could be.

3. The adult was holding onto the other end of the original rescue boat, but stayed in the water and didn't appear to be adding to the situation at that point in time creating greater chaos.

4. Once a number of us understood that the event in front of required kayak rescuing skills, they began to take hold.

What did I take away from this?

1. The need to recognize what is going on around you even if it isn't directly involving people from your group.

2. Don't panic.

3. The importance of a second - third etc. boat to come along side the first boat and have people lay across the deck of the first boat as quickly as possible to stabilize it.

4. Do your best to keep the swimmers informed with what they need to do. The adult did appear to listen, the child out of sheer fear and panic did not.

5. The adult upon my directions let go of the first boat and grabbed the stern of mine allowing me to tow them in.

Questions I have are ??

1. If you were a solo paddler or others in your pod were not so close to you during such an event, how do you stabilize your boat and prevent being capsized by a panicked person in the water?

2. A paddle's edge being used rapidly to scull or brace could be a pretty lethal weapon on a panicking swimmer so how do you use it without endangering the person in the water?

3. Is there a specific person who should be taking charge and giving directions?

4. What else should be done different or looked at from another point of view?

I was appalled at the treatment of the child (who did spit up some water) by the adult after it was all over, but that is another story.

To add some clarification to this incident, boat number one (the closest and first to the scene) was looked upon by the terrified victims as a floatation device. In a panic, their first inclination was to climb upon the kayak which almost made it a triple rescue as stated in Scott's description above. A considerable amount of yelling from boat number one (as he was beginning to panic) was scaring the victims even more. Scott approached kayak number one and braced himself to it to create a stable platform so the child could climb up upon the 2 boats. Nice move.... A third boat pulled along the opposite side and initially did not know what to do but eventually held onto the center boat (number one) for added support. I approached from the outside and bulldogged the 3 parallel boats and victims to the shoreline.

Bull Dog Rescue: Approach a boat(s) from a perpendicular angle (like a "T") and with the bow of your boat push or "Bull Dog" the boat(s) to safety out of harms way.

Thank you Scott C. for going over this at the CAM training.

The mother showed no concern for her daughter and ran off to leave her daughter on the waters edge (very strange). The daughter cloaked up some water and stood around for awhile. Two or three surf casters stood within 50 feet of this and continued to fish while this was going on not phased by the cry's for help in any way. They probably thought they were watching a movie. In reflection, it was a surreal experience that haunts me a bit today.

Thanks Scott for starting this topic. Yes, any rescue is a good one. CAM training should include this scenario next year.

[eneumeier]

[The mother showed no concern for her daughter and ran off to leave her daughter on the waters edge (very strange). ]

Mothers can panic too. She may have been totally freaked out and unable to cope. Just because she appeared calmer in the water does not mean that she was. "Victims" often say "I'm OK, I'm OK" - when they are not. If a "victim" is complaining about something, that is a pretty good indication that they are, in fact, OK.

Liz

[tyson]

To add some clarification to this incident, [...]

Sounds like people did a very good job in responding to the developing/dynamic situation.

Not to make light of it, but it would seem that in this case, even if everyone ended up in the water, there was likely enough skilled paddlers there to keep everyone safe and get everyone back to shore. The question of what if you are alone was raised. In that context, it would seem that one should be much more considered before getting within reach of a swimmer.

This event raises the point that one doesn't need to be a "leader" or "guide" to need NSPN CAM, ACA, BCU, what-ever leadership training. All the skills for being a leader are the same ones needed to be an asset to a group or incident instead of a liability. The next incident victim could be someone in your small, informal group.

[bazzert]

Don't let them grab your paddle, and if they get whacked because you are defending yourself against their "assault", so be it. If needed, whack them deliberately.

I had posted this article before, but what I was really struck by was the story of one of the commenters ...

"When on a trip out to a sandbar on a boat with friends in Mombasa, Kenya I attempted to save someone who was drowning, the man who was sailing the boat.

Approaching the sandbar he collided with it a little roughly and ended up falling overboard on the deep water side of the boat. Naturally im with a bunch of mates and we see the "captain" fall over, much laughter results until we realise he's dead quiet, not even attempting to reach for my friends hand. Much like Mario says in the post above his head was tilted right back, eyes glazed over minimal movement just spray coming from his mouth as he hyperventilated.

I looked around at everyone who had resorted to screaming at him and offering hands to him and decided I'd jump in. I'd seen it before on TV, I'd done some lifesaving training when I was in the scouts, its a doddle right?

No.

The moment I touched him he instantly tried to use my body as a platform. He kicked me in the private parts, elbowed my face, clawed/scrammed/gouged up my shoulders and face just to climb higher as I slowly sunk. He finally decided he was safe when his legs were wrapped around my arms preventing me from fighting back. Under the water with a man now sitting on my head I couldn't swim and my legs were merely slowing the inevitable, I was already too low under the surface to even get gasps of air.

It was only another friend who jumped over from a second boat having seen this unfold only been too far away to help decided rather than trying to approach the clearly distressed but no longer drowning man to instead simply deliver a swift punch to his face, swam around behind him as he fell off (his legs let me go allowing me to throw him off at that point) and dragged him the 3 ft to the sandbar.

I was within 1 mtr of solid ground and while trying to rescue someone I almost sacrificed myself instead.

If ever you jump in after someone be sure you know what the hell your doing. As for being overpowered he was a lithe kenyan fella, im a 5ft 11 rugby player sized character, in a fight I'd have said I'd have won anyday. It is surprising just how much strength and frenzied aggression adrenaline can cause and while im no fan of violence im bloody glad my mate can throw a decent punch."

[eneumeier]

If I were alone and came across a panicked swimmer, I think I would want to stay clear of them, take off my pfd and toss it to them. I would not want to risk being capsized in that situation. Liz

[Pintail]

Interesting posts, these.

I think, all things being equal, I'd have tried to have the child swimmer (referred to in other post) cling onto the bows of my boat, with legs up around boat, where I could watch him or her. If solo, in those circumstances, then child at bows and adult at stern (just hanging onto toggle) -- and neither of them actually <on> my kayak. Easy to theorize, though, isn't it?

Regarding Mombasa -- there is no sandbar there! (Coral reef...yes...)

[spider]

I remembered seeing this link over at paddling.net.

I'm thinking in terms of the fishermen not noticing one way or the other.

http://mariovittone.com/2010/05/154/

[djlewis]

The question of what if you are alone was raised. In that context, it would seem that one should be much more considered before getting within reach of a swimmer.]

If I were alone and came across a panicked swimmer, I think I would want to stay clear of them, take off my pfd and toss it to them. I would not want to risk being capsized in that situation. Liz

Or blow up your paddle float and toss that. Might be easier, safer for you, more useful to the swimmer, etc.

--David.

[billfont]

To add some clarification to this incident, boat number one (the closest and first to the scene) was looked upon by the terrified victims as a floatation device. In a panic, their first inclination was to climb upon the kayak which almost made it a triple rescue as stated in Scott's description above. A considerable amount of yelling from boat number one (as he was beginning to panic) was scaring the victims even more. Scott approached kayak number one and braced himself to it to create a stable platform so the child could climb up upon the 2 boats. Nice move.... A third boat pulled along the opposite side and initially did not know what to do but eventually held onto the center boat (number one) for added support. I approached from the outside and bulldogged the 3 parallel boats and victims to the shoreline.

Bull Dog Rescue: Approach a boat(s) from a perpendicular angle (like a "T") and with the bow of your boat push or "Bull Dog" the boat(s) to safety out of harms way.

Thank you Scott for going over this at the CAM training.

The mother showed no concern for her daughter and ran off to leave her daughter on the waters edge (very strange). The daughter cloaked up some water and stood around for awhile. Two or three surf casters stood within 50 feet of this and continued to fish while this was going on not phased by the cry's for help in any way. They probably thought they were watching a movie. In reflection, it was a surreal experience that haunts me a bit today.

Thanks Scott for starting this topic. Yes, any rescue is a good one. CAM training should include this scenario next year.

There was a third swimmer in this group (8 or 9 year old boy) who listened to direction well and was towed to shore safely by grabbing my stern toggle. I credit the CAM at Odiorne this year on knowing how to handle this situation. If it weren't for learning what I did at the CAM I'm not sure if it would have gone the same way.

Shockingly the mother of this boy did not seem to look for him or show any concern.

[leong]

For some reason I couldn’t post to Liz’s post, so here it is quoted again:

“If I were alone and came across a panicked swimmer, I think I would want to stay clear of them, take off my pfd and toss it to them. I would not want to risk being capsized in that situation. Lizâ€

Bingo, Liz. Like Occam's Razor, I believe a tossed PFD is the best solution (and usually the simplest solution is the best solution). You don’t need to be highly skilled and be able to do sculling brace or any other such heroics. An attached towline would be good, but be ready to release it if the panicked swimmer uses it to get too close. I’d use it first, even if there were lots of kayaks nearby. No PFD, then throw an inflated paddle float. Spoken based on knowledge from when I was a NJ surf lifeguard.

[konstantin_art]

Dear Fellow Paddlers,

In case you want to hear the anonymous “original rescue boat†or “first boat†kayaker’s own take on this incident.

I talked to him and here are his thoughts.

Here it goes:

• “The situation wasn’t recognized immediately as a rescue because there was a discrepancy between what we glanced at while underway and the “Help!†cries. The mother and child were just floating and not trashing in the water, so the help cries came a little disconnected from the actual visual scene. It took us just a moment before we realized that they were indeed serious and not playing around. At that point, I believe three boats headed directly toward the family.

• I knew very well (from training and numerous accounts) that one should warn the swimmer NOT to attempt climbing on the rescuer’s kayak and make them AGREE with this BEFORE the kayak makes contact with them. One also warns them ahead of time that they will be whacked with the paddle if they do not cooperate with this. There were several facts, though, that made me forego this crucial point in every “proper†swimmer rescue:

1. There was a little, frightened and panicked girl in the water who wouldn’t listen to any instructions and agreements but act on survival instinct only (and I was proved right). Therefore, there was no point in trying to make a deal with her and her mother. If the mother would have agreed to cooperate the girl would have still acted the way she ultimately did. And, of course, paddle whacking was out of question.

2. “Don’t make yourself a victim!†-the adage goes. Given the fact that we were so close to the shore AND surrounded by a large group of paddlers, it was a no-brainer for me to choose to act swiftly even if I was risking of being capsized. In such a case the 3 of us would have hold onto the kayak. I would have tried to swim the “combo†to the shore, or even better -recruit someone to tow us ashore. It was more important to give the girl (especially) IMMEDIATE relief from her situation. Holding onto something stable would have prevented more water swallowing. I did not know her exact condition (or the exact nature of the emergency). All I saw were the BIG scared eyes of one little girl who needed help NOW.

What would I have done if this did not happen a few meters off the shore? If there is a child involved the answer would have been the same –go give the swimmer something to hold onto. It is reassuring and potentially life saving! Whether I will remain in the boat or not is a secondary question. If I am well prepared (VHF, Cell Phone, paddling buddy or 2 or 3) I will have options for collective rescue. If the water is too cold I can put the child in the dry cockpit to save us time. Enough said. The point is to be prepared!

• For those of you that did not have “the best seats in the house†and the best vantage point to see all the details –here is something that you must have missed, apparently.

The poor child AND the woman (her mother) BOTH tried to climb on my front deck all from the SAME starboard side. I don’t dare to judge the reasoning of a distressed person –the mother for not using common sense to realize that this is not a catamaran but a tippy kayak. This one-sided “assault†made me work hard to stay upright. A few deep low braces did the trick miraculously. I guess I still have to work on my “sculling braces under pressureâ€. I couldn’t believe my eyes when the mother attempted climbing on the front deck. At that time I was already fighting an induced starboard edge (by the girl climbing). That is why I didn’t even attempt to counterbalance with an edge and a sculling brace on the opposite side. My paddle was already on the right side so I worked what was the fastest solution for the moment. Changing sides might have capsized me.

• You do NOT talk to uncooperative, panicked “victims†with the sweet mellow voice of Morgan Freeman (that can put you to sleep). At least not in the beginning. In order to cut through the haze and tunnel vision (and mind) of a “victim†one has to speak in an assertive, authoritarian manner which includes yelling. Yes yelling. Let’s leave the “gentle manners†for gentle situations. Only after you get their attention you can adopt the “Morgan Freeman†voice. When they start acknowledging your instructions you can tone down and start comforting them while giving instructions to follow. And this is exactly what I did with the poor little girl lying like a frog on my front deck. And I saw her eyes starting to relax. It warmed my heart. I talked to her the whole short time we were being moved towards the shore.

In retrospect, would I do it differently? The answer is –I would change only one thing. I would recruit the help of a fellow nearby kayaker to raft up and approach the swimmers as a stable platform. That’s it.

In conclusion I would like to thank everyone who got involved (physically and emotionally) with this successful rescue.

Thank you!

Everything is well when it ends well!â€

There you have it folks! 60 seconds with the anonymous “original rescue boat†kayaker!

He wishes to remain anonymous.

[Michael_Crouse]

First off excellent work saving them.

I'm going to offer a differing opinion, I would have rushed right in and risked being capsized. My reasoning being it doesn't sound like the group was too far behind, I'm wearing a pfd and immersion wear, and in a worst case scenerio I could put the swimmer on the capsized boat and wait for the other paddlers or leave the kayak and swim the kid to shore.

Of course who knows what I would have actually done in that situation since you get about 5 seconds to make your decision and I always waste 2-3 seconds of that time thinking "Oh *^"

[konstantin_art]

I'm going to offer a differing opinion, I would have rushed right in and risked being capsized. My

Michael,

If you read the above post more carefully you will notice that this is exactly the reasoning and action of the anonymous “first boat†kayaker.

You are both in agreement here!

[spuglisi]

Michael,

If you read the above post more carefully you will notice that this is exactly the reasoning and action of the anonymous “first boat†kayaker.

You are both in agreement here!

To the anonymous first kayaker....Outstanding job Konstanin! To Scott Kimball, Bill Fontaine, Bill Harter, Doug Mogill and any others who jumped in to help....Outstanding job!

Also.....A big thanks to the continuing string of NSPN paddlers who continue to pass skills forward, encourage people to hone their own skills and encourage people to swim, practice and become comfortable in their boats as well as in the water. I'm sure that the rescuees have no idea of the chain of events that led to a group of capable paddlers being in the right spot at the right time to, literally, save their lives.

[Gcosloy]

For some reason I couldn’t post to Liz’s post, so here it is quoted again:

“If I were alone and came across a panicked swimmer, I think I would want to stay clear of them, take off my pfd and toss it to them. I would not want to risk being capsized in that situation. Lizâ€

Bingo, Liz. Like Occam's Razor, I believe a tossed PFD is the best solution (and usually the simplest solution is the best solution).

I agree with everything Liz and Leon said, although I usually prefer Gillette's razor.

[Katherine]

Great job, all of you! Many kudos,

[Michael_Crouse]

Sal I typed really slowly (took a diaper changing break!) so the previous post wasn't up I posted.

Once again great job everyone, seems like every year someone in this club saves a life!

[spuglisi]

, seems like every year someone in this club saves a life!

Or, creates one....congrats on your new addition.

[Bmach]

Would it have been better to have the mom holding the front of the kayak with her legs wrapped around it? Instead of towing her. I helped a swimmer once that on a long swim across a bay got to tired to swim anymore. I had him grab my bow and wrap his legs around the kayak and it worked well for that. I am curious as to why you towed her. Is one way better than the other?

Great job with a good ending for all!

[bob budd]

There are many factors to this sort of decision. First of all, the person may be warmer in the water than in the air. A person on the boat would be less of a drag than someone in the water. As for the kayak(er) the person at either end upsets the trim of the boat dramatically but wrapped around the hull versus on the deck is centered about the kayak. If on the deck, lying on/lowest to the deck (somehow) is best and consistent with accepted practice on reentering a kayak.

[rick stoehrer]

There are many factors to this sort of decision. First of all, the person may be warmer in the water than in the air. A person on the boat would be less of a drag than someone in the water. As for the kayak(er) the person at either end upsets the trim of the boat dramatically but wrapped around the hull versus on the deck is centered about the kayak. If on the deck, lying on/lowest to the deck (somehow) is best and consistent with accepted practice on reentering a kayak.

huh? the person may be warmer in the water than in the air? when are you rescuing this swimmer that the water temp is warmer than the air temp?

as for swimmer hanging on the stern or bow with their legs wrapped around...they and you are more stable with them in the water than with them laying flat on the top of the boat. you as a paddler have more directional control of the boat with them out of the water rather than acting as a drogue in any capacity in the water, but to have them on the boat is more unstable than with them in the drink.

so if you're pointed in the direction you wanna go and they're wrapped up, hanging on there...eh, it's not fast but it's stable....if they're flat on the boat, it's faster, less stable but you have more directional control.

if they're know what they're doing back there, have presence of mind and all that, you can even surf a bit with a person on the back of the boat...did some swimmer rescues at the RWS in the surf zone...but those were all "water" folks and kinda knew what they're doing.