jonsprag1

Hi and welcome to Maine----for "quiet" paddles your best bet is on the west and south side of Mount Desert Island----I would recommend putting in at Pretty Marsh and paddling around Bartletts Island or if you are more skilled and/or adventurous put in at Seal Cove on the west side of MDI and paddle out to Tinker---about a 3 mile paddle one way or out to Pond--about a 5 mile paddle---also a good trip is from either Northeast Harbor, Southwest Harbor or Seal Harbor(not Cove) on the south side of the island out to the Cranberries---again about a 3-4 mile paddle one way---You can also paddle from Northeast Harbor up Sommes Sound to Sommesville---but you really have to time this trip with the tide. And then there is paddling from Bar Harbor out to the Porcupines (and Ironbound if you are adventurous and the weather is nice.)This time of year that would be crowded with the commercial seakayak tours run out of Bar Harbor Your final choices are to the north side of MDI from Bar Harbor along the east side of the Island north to Hadley Point and then if you like and conditions are favorable across the bay to Lamoine Beach State Park--about a mile crossing at that point---enjoy

It's odd how someone can go 30 to 50 years without ever being motionsick and then all of a sudden it comes right out of the blue. I've never experienced it on the water but have guided clients who have---including one very nice lady in her late 30ths who never had it before---oddly enough her bout occurred when we were going downwind in chop about 2 feet. We stopped on an island for about 20 minutes, she felt better and we were able to paddle back to the put in---about a 30 minute paddle with no problems---she told me that going into the wind didn't seem to upset her. The only time I ever had it was in the air, on a commercial flight in a relativly small plane(Beech 99)---now I have a private pilots license and have all kinds of time in VERY small planes on windy days---all with no problem---but on that particular flight it was a hot muggy day and very bumpy---I had no problems until the guy sitting next to me had to use the airsickness bag----all of a sudden I had to too---so being seasick really doesn't have much to do with experience etc---more to do with circumstances and, dare I say it, luck. I suspect that anybody can get it given the right set of events.

you aint really a man until you've barfed on your sray skirt at least twice

Where did you start and finish---did you paddle to Vinalhaven from Rockland(or elswhere on west penobscot bay) then do a side trip to Stonington and return or did you start from someplace else Also what islands did you camp on---I'm assuming Ram on Hurricane sound but there are two others on the East side of VH and a ton of them in the Stonington area

sounds like its way too small for me to enjoy---as far as the skill level goes--well maybe--but if it is too small then probably not worth it---just sign me always a bridesmaid, never a bride

didn't try to fit into it---just saw it on the shelf and was smitten---no the 170 doesn't feel huge to me although I paddled an Impex force cat 4 saturday---longer than my boat but a little narrower---and much more responsive

how small do you have to be to fit into the boat---I noticed it was a small cockpit --I'm 6'0" 178 or so---too big?

that's force cat 4---My dyslexia tends to surface from time to time--lol

Has anybody tried this nigel foster designed boat---I saw one at MaineSport yesterday and immeadiatly had the hots for it. Seems like the ultimate day boat(as opposed to expedition) 16+ feet, 19.5 inches, 42 lbs---also googled it and got confused on the specs---read on the net it was 16'8" but the sign in the shop said 16'0"--also net said 44 lbs---has anybody tried this boat out yet--or better yet has anybody bought one---when I asked about rental for a day was told that I could try it in their pond outback but no rental to go to the ocean(only one they had) the sales clerk kind of smiled and said he didn't expect anyone to pay the 3455.00 price until they had tried it on the ocean in conditions.---anybody know where I could rent one?

I paddled a catforce 4 saturday on a trip to Placentia Island out of Bass Harbor(south side of MDI) A friend of mine was trying a borrowed one out prepatory to buying one----I was impressed--- light, easy turning boat(all I had to do to turn was lift a buttock one way or the other)---didnt get a chance to try it in conditions but I suspect it would perform well----only drawback to long distance touring is that it is a low volume boat and for an 18 footer there does not seem to be a lot of storage space due to width--about 21.5 inches and depth. We did go around the south side of Big Black Island where we were exposed to open ocean swell with some breaking surf(which three out of the party of four stayed away from)---my friend was paddling through some confused seas with clapaoitis(sp?) and seemed to be doing fine. Also seems like a very fast boat.

no we didn't hear anything---was that 2pm last saturday the 9th of June? We would have been between Merchant and Steeve at that time, quite a distance away with Isle au Haut in between.

Harbor certainly is one option---others are Burnt, Wheat, Dollivers(next to York Island on the east side of Isle au Haut) It's about a three mile paddle more or less from Harbor to IaH village Burnt and Wheat are closer and are reasonably good sites---Could also camp on Kimballs on the north end.

Funny you should mention a circumnavigation of Isle au Haut---a friend of mine and I are going to do that later this summer--the plan was to leave Old Quarry and either go around Isle au haut the first day then camp on kimball, burnt or wheat or camp on those islands then get up real early the second day and paddle around Isle au Haut and maybe camp the second night on a MITA island as well. Doing a circumnavigation of Isle au Haut in one day does involve 25 miles of paddling(at least) Its 15 miles out and back to the Island(I have measured it on my GPS) and then at least 10, if not more(according to my chart, it could well be more) miles around it. On a calm day it would be doable assuming an early start(around 7am or so) and relativly fit paddlers---if the weather is breezy (over 10--15 knots) you might want to consider a different trip, particularly if it is out of the south or north. I've never been to Swan's island but it is easily a doable trip if you put in near Neskeag or Little Deer Isle---could even be done from Old Quarry--I know people who have done it from the West side of MDI--put in a Seal Cove paddled down to Sheep Island off Old Quarry and returned.(it was a two day trip but it took them right past Swans

Took some friends from MDI paddlers out to Isle au Haut today---put in at Old Quarry campground, went out past Hells Half Acre, Buckle McClathery's, Wheat, Burnt and then had lunch on the Isle au Haut town dock---went back by way of Merchants, Steeves, Green and Russ---round trip 15.1 statute miles. For those of you from "away" who think the end all and be all of paddling in Maine is Bar Harbor or elsewhere on MDI, three of these guys were from there and paddle there every week--they all admitted without prompting that the paddling in the Stonington area was the best they had ever experienced. It didn't hurt that the weather was absolutly perfect.

Just so everybody knows--it wasn't an offshore wind and I could have returned to Tinker or paddled downwind to Pretty Marsh landing on MDI with little or no trouble---In fact thats what happened eventually we veered our course to land on Moose and then were able to paddle back to the put in quite easily---My problem is that I wanted to go directly back (again quite easily) but it wasn't in the cards that day---thanks for all the advice everybody---maybe I can use all of this to convince my wife I need a new boat.

never had a problem with weather cocking just lee cocking---In fact the boat going downwind with me has excellent manners both full and empty---I've had it in quartering breezes up the 25 knots--put the skeg halfway down and no problem at all---I'm 180+ or - a pound or two and 6' tall---according to all the specs the 170 should be ideal for me (and usually is) I suppose it is a question of developing my technique in those kind of waves and winds.

Possibly--what I have to do is go in conditions and with that angle into the wind and play---I frequently paddle in those types of waves and wind but don't often go into the 5--20 degree angle or when I do the wind is strong, but the waves are not particularly high or vice versa---3-4 foot waves but only 10--15 knot wind---anyway thanks for all the advice everybody and I'll keep you posted---if it only happens to me once every two years then its probably not going to be a serious problem---still it is something to work on.

Definitly the problem could be with the paddler as opposed to the boat---if I was a larger person maybe I wouldn't be having this problem(ok really not much of a problem since in the 4 years I've been paddling the boat only happened twice) but also maybe the answer is to work on my skillset in those types of conditions--I know what to do and can do it---the question is for how long---without reaching the point of exhaustion---I suppose that most of us are in that boat(pun intended) On the paddling.net site a poster suggested exactly what you said---I've also been told here and on the other site that the 170 may be too large for me---never felt that way but hey who knows---I have seen a lot of people, including some female guides paddling the T-170, who were a lot smaller that me and were having no problem. Just keep working on it I guess BTW cant' seem to get through to flatpick---he has some automatic screening program on his e-mail which rejects my letters to him.

Thanks for the advice folks. I have written the designer of the tempest to find out what he thinks---if I get a response I'll post it here. Like I said earlier I've had this boat for 4 years now and really like it. Under most circumstances the volume is not a problem---particularly not a problem when I go on a five day trip and can easily pack every thing. I also like the performance of the boat going down wind, cross wind or directly into the wind---its the turning issue that I have that is bothersome when I'm 5 to 25 degrees off the wind and then only when the boat is empty--not a problem when full of camping gear--other than that the boat is a dream---It is particularly good in a quatering sea with waves and wind coming from the left or right rear quarter---absolutly minimal weather cocking. It wasn't a big thing or a significant problem last saturday---more of an annoyance which I would like to fix. Thanks for the suggestions---I suppose the best thing to do would be to have two or more boats. That means two things---convincing my SO that its ok to do that--and finding space to put two.

That's exactly who I was with---nice bunch of guys

of the three boats that didn't seem to be having significant problems one was a Necky Eskia with a rudder, the other was some type of kitbuilt boat---about 17+ long again with a rudder and the third was a kitbuilt shearwater with no rudder or skeg, but as I said above it had an LV fordeck---the other boat having the problem was a kitbuilt boat---I think a CLC but dont know the model again with no skeg and rudder----I have no signicificant problem once I'm 35--40 degrees off the wind and have never had a problem with weather cocking---can run downwind and crosswind to my hearts content---also if I'm headed right into the wind there is no problem--its only on headings 5---25 or so degrees off the wind. hanks for the advice on contacting the designer---I'll send him an e-mail and hopefully he will have some good advice.

Actually adjusting the trim when loaded is not really the problem here---the boat never leecocks when it is loaded---it only does it when it is empty and only then when the seas are 2 feet or more with a short period---and the wind is over 20 knots--ie in steep seas with higher winds---what happens is that the bow will rise out of the water and the wind will catch it and point the boat downwind before I get a chance to correct it with a lean or a corrective forward sweep on the lee side(or a combination with both) I then have to do a series of forward sweeps on the lee side followed by a bowrudder and a forward stoke(to maintain speed) on the windward side---if I just have to do it once in a while, no problem but every other wave it does become exhausting after 45 minutes or so. And it only does this when I'm paddling 10--30 degrees off the relative wind---when I'm headed right into the wind or down wind I'm fine. Are you folks suggesting that I add some type of weight to an empty forward hatch when paddling in conditions? Of the people I was with---three were having no significant problem with leecocking and the fourth was having a harder time than me--of the three, two had rudders but the third not only had no rudder but no skeg either---what he did have was a very low foredeck on his kitbuilt boat. btw Mine does relativly well in following seas---no tendancy to weathercock much at all. finally both times when this has occured I was paddling a boat with nothing in either the rear or forward compartments---the only weight was either in the cockpit--me--on in the day hatch directly behind the cockpit---just my lunch---no more than a pound, a spare fleece and a paddle jacket.

I was paddling on the west side of MDI this Saturday with 4 other experienced paddlers that I have gone out with before --the morning started calm with good visibility and with a forecast of winds of no more than 5knots all day. We decided to paddle to Pond Island---about 6 miles from our starting point of Seal Cove. The sea was calm on our way to Pond, so on the way back we took a short detour to Tinker Island for lunch. As we approached Tinker the breeze began to stir and by the time lunch was over, it had picked up to about 20 knots out of the east south east and east. As we rounded the South end of Tinker---through quite a bit of rough water caused by the bar between Tinker and Bar Island, we could see that the trip back to Seal Cove(about2.5--3miles) was going to be quite a slog. The wind had freshened and was picking up speed comming down off Seal Mountain(just behind Seal Cove) 20 gusting higher with steep chop around 3 feet---I and one of the other paddlers, both of us relativly experienced, began having trouble with lee cocking---the ferry angle we had established required that we hold our bows about 10--20 degrees off the wind but my boat and my friend's wanted to go downwind---I've had this happen to me once before, in similar conditions, and now know enough to raise my skeg completely and correct the downwind motion by a series of forward sweeps on the downwind side followed by a bow rudder.(I also knew enough not to use a reverse sweep or ruddering stroke on the upwind side as this causes the boat to slow and the bow to raise, making the leecocking worse) However having to do this frequentily in rough seas can be quite tiring---eventually my friend George had his boat lee cock to the point where he could not get his his bow to point into the wind at all---he asked me to give his bow a nudge but as I was attempting to do that, he suggested we paddle down wind to an island on the downwind side of Seal Cove and then go up the side of the cove back to the launching site from there. We were able to do that with relativly little problem. My problem is that I want to be able to control the lee cocking better---I've been told that putting more weight in the forward compartment might help. I've also figured out that my boat, a WS Tempest 170, has a relativly high freeboard forward of the cockpit and thus has a tendancy to leecock more than other boats with lower freeboard. I have noticed that when I'm on a camping trip with my boat loaded with 100+ lbs of gear and me---178 pounds---I don't seem to have any trouble with lee cocking---possibly need to gain about 100 lbs, get a new, smaller boat with less free board(not really an option for me right now and besides, aside from the above problem I really like the T-170) or develop the endurance of a marathoner in rough seas ----any suggestions from those of you out there who may have experienced similar problems? The first time it happened to me, I wasn't able to turn my bow into the wind at all---this time because of the above mentioned forward sweep/bow rudder combination I was able to do it and keep on course but at a cost of becoming quite tired. Please feel free to let me know if there is a quick fix out there---or is this something I just have to live with until I gain a lot of weight or get a new boat?

Take my advice--it really doesn't matter what color you paint it as long as you let Gillian choose the color----that way you won't have to listen to any complaints.

Incredibly smooth moves---reminds me of my whitewater days---of course I managed to roll up only about 50% of my combat rolls(I figure its because white water is less dense, filled with thousands of those little bubbles making it more difficult to brace---lol or I was just a klutz who would panic once his head was down.)