rwolson Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Good morning,Last Sunday I went to my storage unit to pick up one of my kayaks and go for a niice long paddle on a lake. I planned on doing three laps, but instead found some cracks in the gelcoat. I looked in the hatches, but did not see nay real damage. However, I decided to paddle use my other touring boat to paddle the lake and left after one lap because of the windy conditions.Yesterday, I picked up a fiberglass repair kit at West Marine thinking I could just add a layer of glass mat and resin under the cracksecided to shine a bright light and used a mirror to check for cracks going through the fiberglass. Yes, I see them. I noticed some of the cracks maybe around six inches long. No idea when the cracks showed up or what caused them. I've never dropped the boat and never over tighten the tiedown straps.My question, how do I proceed? Do I laminate the areas using a technique described here? - http://www.seakayakermag.com/2006/Feb06/Gel-Coat01.htm If yes, do you recommend using the same glass glass which came in the kit or different types of mat?I suspect the repair may turn into a summer project. I can paddle one of my other boats. I've never done a fiberglass work, but applied mud and tape to walls, removed textured ceilings and skimmed coated them, played with epoxies. I believe working with FG's no more difficult.I'm just looking for recommendations before I get myself in too deep and spend way too much money. If I need to drop the boat off at a shop I'll do it, but learning how to work on your boat's part of the joy(s) of boat ownership.Thanks,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateHanson Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 When you say you used a bright light and a mirror, and could see the cracks from the inside, do you mean that you had the light outside, and could see some light shining through the gelcoat cracks to the inside of the boat? Or do you mean that with a bright light inside the boat, you could see physical cracks in the inside layers of fiberglass?If you just see light making it's way through the gelcoat cracks, but see no damage to the fiberglass layers, I'd guess you don't have any damage, and would suggest you forget about this and go paddle. Press on the outside of the boat, to see if the area with gelcoat cracking is any softer than the rest of the boat. If there's damage, you'll probably feel it. Nate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwolson Posted June 26, 2011 Author Share Posted June 26, 2011 Nate,I placed the flashlight and mirror inside the hatch. Also, I can catch a fingernail on a crack. I suspect the cracks didn't break thruough the FG. The deck around the cracks feels solid when pushing against it, but probably weakening the FG. I watched another video on Youtube. I believe I'll add some patches using a few layers for added strength.Thanks,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Nate, I placed the flashlight and mirror inside the hatch. Also, I can catch a fingernail on a crack. I suspect the cracks didn't break thruough the FG. The deck around the cracks feels solid when pushing against it, but probably weakening the FG. I watched another video on Youtube. I believe I'll add some patches using a few layers for added strength. Thanks, Rich It does sound like you've got some glass damage, so repairing it is a good idea. However, I would recommend that you get glass cloth rather than mat, as it's stronger and uses less resin than mat. 3 layers of 6 oz cloth or a couple of layers of 9 oz. tape should be sufficient to reinforce the cracked area. I would recommend epoxy for the repair, rather than polyester resin, as again, it's stronger and it's far less noxious to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwolson Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 Brain,I'm, assuming your talking about the following product - http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&partNumber=9860495&langId=-1 I'll just need to find a smaller quantity if yes. Also, I believe you're talking about the epoxy on the same link? Rereading your response I searched for 6z glass cloth finding some at Amamazon - http://www.amazon.com/Fibre-Glass-Evercoat-100912-Fiberglass/dp/B002MJDTM8 which maybe what you recommended.Thanks,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Brain, I'm, assuming your talking about the following product - http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&partNumber=9860495&langId=-1 I'll just need to find a smaller quantity if yes. Also, I believe you're talking about the epoxy on the same link?No, that's biaxial glass sewn to a layer of mat. All you need is plain 6 or 9 ounce woven glass or tape. You can get it at pretty much any marine supplier. I've even seen it at Home Depot. Rereading your response I searched for 6z glass cloth finding some at Amamazon - http://www.amazon.com/Fibre-Glass-Evercoat-100912-Fiberglass/dp/B002MJDTM8 which maybe what you recommended.Correct. I've used Evercoat products many times, both their glass (cloth and tape) and epoxy. That was what my local Home Depot carried, though I'm not sure that they do any longer. I just happened to spot it when I was there looking for something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwolson Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Brian,I picked up a 3M cloth at Home Depot. Hopefully, the right sutff. If not I'll just order some onlineThanks,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwolson Posted July 19, 2011 Author Share Posted July 19, 2011 Just a quick update.I completed the FG reapirs. I found some of the damage I expected didn't exist, but decided to still add FG under the crazed gelcoat. Also, fixed one section which made a creaking sound when pushed. So, the deck's secure, but I may fix the gelcoat this fall.I found working with FG and epoxy very easy. However, a couple of cautions. Wear good gloves and a long sleeved shirt. My left forearm broke out in a rash. I had washed some epoxy off my forearms, but still received the rash. I believe I wiped epoxy on my arm when tugging on the sleeve of a gaunlet glove. Also, if you do FG in sections over a few days wear new gloves. I encountered some problems with epoxy wetted FG sticking to my gloves and failing to stick to inside of the hull. So, new nitrile gloves each session. I wore two pair; one for contamination and another for cleanup, etc. I'm more cautious after looking at the rash on my armOverall, an easy job. No patching holes, etc. Thanks for all of the advice because I learned a lot here. Brian, looked at your photos on WebShots too; thanks for providing all the details on the site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 I'm glad to hear that everything worked out for you. Some people are allergic to epoxy and apparently you're one of them. I would strongly suggest that you wear a chemical respirator in addition to gloves, as it's possible that the (generally minor) fumes from epoxy could also irritate your lungs. Also, be very careful if you do any sanding. It's possible to become so sensitized that you can't be anywhere near uncured epoxy, but fortunately once it's cured, it's inert and non-allergenic. Minimize your exposure and contact, and you should be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterB Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 I'm glad to hear that everything worked out for you. Some people are allergic to epoxy and apparently you're one of them. I would strongly suggest that you wear a chemical respirator in addition to gloves, as it's possible that the (generally minor) fumes from epoxy could also irritate your lungs. Also, be very careful if you do any sanding. It's possible to become so sensitized that you can't be anywhere near uncured epoxy, but fortunately once it's cured, it's inert and non-allergenic. Minimize your exposure and contact, and you should be fine. Another advantage of epoxy resins over polyester is that cleanup can be done with water and denatured alcohol. Water does not work at all as a cleanup for polyester resins (denatured alcohol sort of works): water and polyester resins seem to be real enemies, so you have to use something like acetone, which is a pretty nasty product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwolson Posted July 20, 2011 Author Share Posted July 20, 2011 Definitely more good advice from Brian and Peter.My intent, post my experiences in case others decided to perform their own repairs and learn from my stupidity.BTW, I wore the respirator when sanding, but since I basically worked outside removed it when mixing the epoxy and applying the FG. Next, time I'll need to practice more caution and wear the respirator. BTW, steer clear of the paper masks because they're hard to breath through and fog your glasses. The real respirators work much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Another advantage of epoxy resins over polyester is that cleanup can be done with water and denatured alcohol. Water does not work at all as a cleanup for polyester resins (denatured alcohol sort of works): water and polyester resins seem to be real enemies, so you have to use something like acetone, which is a pretty nasty product. Be careful about using alcohol to remove epoxy from your skin, as it thins the epoxy which can allow it to penetrate more, which is exactly what you don't want. Soap and water is better, or vinegar will neutralize epoxy and it wash off easily. Denatured alcohol is great for removing epoxy from tools and surfaces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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