REI Demo Day

[brwells]

NSPN has assisted REI for years with the Paddle Demo Day. Last year we had eight of us and we had a great time assisting over 300 people in all sorts of paddle craft.

The event description:

http://www.rei.com/stores/store_event_deta...;ignore_cache=1

This year the event is being held on June 8 at Lake Cochituate in Framingham. Yes, further away from most of us than last year, but the parking is much better. We need to be there from 9:30 to 2 PM.

We will have the NSPN booth set up and all volunteers get a free lunch, discount coupons for REI purchases, lots of laughs, and the very occasional rescue practice.

You do not need to be experienced with waves, rocks, trip leading, etc.; just be confident in your kayak, respond to the occasional question, and be able to gently tell people to get back into the area designated by REI. Any experience herding cats will be very useful.

I already have a few volunteers, but I need more! Please respond via email; and if you can only do part of the day, that is also okay.

Brian

brian@nspn.org

[hopefloats]

photos in the gallery from previous years... this is a fun day!!!

http://www.nspn.org/forum/index.php?autoco...bum&album=4

[subaruguru]

Hi Brian,

REI contacted me about this about this in April, confused why their announcement was moved from the Board. I suggested that they join nspn as a dues-paying member, so they finally did.

I've enjoyed this demo day the past three years, but unfortunately I'm giving a piano recital later that afternoon (unless canceled as we may not get the hall in time), so can't attend this year.

They seemed to be getting better at NOT sending out little kids with 240cm paddles and big Tsunamis lately, so have fun, and say hi to everybody for me.

Ern

[brwells]

I'm giving a piano recital later that afternoon (unless canceled as we may not get the hall in time), so can't attend this year.

They seemed to be getting better at NOT sending out little kids with 240cm paddles and big Tsunamis lately, so have fun, and say hi to everybody for me.

Ern

We will miss you, Ernie. And you will certainly miss the backwards paddles, the giant canoe-yak, the showoffs (always boys, why?), and the unexpected.

Brian

[Gillian]

i'll be there for water safety aka chasing down kids who don't listen

[Suz]

We will miss you, Ernie. And you will certainly miss the backwards paddles, the giant canoe-yak, the showoffs (always boys, why?), and the unexpected.

Brian

I am really glad to see the tradition continue. I did this for three years for NSPN including my first year with the club. I answered questions at the booth and introduced NSPN to many wannabe paddlers.

Ernie -the only reason Dane's post would have been moved as it was a commercial event. Not a bad thing - just what it is. No reason why commercial activities shouldn't be posted on commercial board.

The reason why the post can now be on the regular message board is that NSPN coordinator for the event - guess that's Brian Wells, is looking for volunteers.

Things to remember about this event is that as a safety boater, you will be asked questions, remember although NSPN is primarily a sea kayaking club, loads of boats at REI are not sea kayaks. Not bad to explain what the designed purpose of the boat they are demoing is for if you are asked but it isn't fair to make assumptions that because we paddle sea kayaks, sea kayaks are for everyone.

Remember to ask where they are intending to paddle with the boat they are looking for. I read a recent post on paddling.net about a demo down in Connecticut and the poster was really upset and confused as the "expert on the water" suggested that his boat choice was the wrong one. It wasn't the wrong one for his stated purpose but he didn't really understand the whole thing about boats are designed with specific purposes in mind.

So there is my two cents...

As usual, I will be there on behalf of Kokatat with dry suits and pfds. Drop on by the booth if you attend.

Suz

[hopefloats]

I'll help with the booth that day!

[subaruguru]

Hi Brian,

REI contacted me about this about this in April, confused why their announcement was moved from the Board. I suggested that they join nspn as a dues-paying member, so they finally did.

I've enjoyed this demo day the past three years, but unfortunately I'm giving a piano recital later that afternoon (unless canceled as we may not get the hall in time), so can't attend this year.

They seemed to be getting better at NOT sending out little kids with 240cm paddles and big Tsunamis lately, so have fun, and say hi to everybody for me.

Ern

We moved the recital to Tuesday June 10, with a dress on Sunday. So I probably WILL attend.

Ern

[subaruguru]

Things to remember about this event is that as a safety boater, you will be asked questions, remember although NSPN is primarily a sea kayaking club, loads of boats at REI are not sea kayaks. Not bad to explain what the designed purpose of the boat they are demoing is for if you are asked but it isn't fair to make assumptions that because we paddle sea kayaks, sea kayaks are for everyone.

Remember to ask where they are intending to paddle with the boat they are looking for. I read a recent post on paddling.net about a demo down in Connecticut and the poster was really upset and confused as the "expert on the water" suggested that his boat choice was the wrong one. It wasn't the wrong one for his stated purpose but he didn't really understand the whole thing about boats are designed with specific purposes in mind.

Hi Suz!

I remember how careful you were fitting attendees to the correct PFDs for their sizes, to the point of refusing to allow some to try a wrong fit. I only wish the boat reps exercized similar care when tossing folks into their demos.

I happened to be at an REI this week (Perrine's now a biker!), and I think that they're NOT offering much variety this year. I'll be recommending the Necky Manitou 14 as a great all-rounder for novices and advanced beginners. Hope they have one to try.

Cheers.

[Suz]

I remember how careful you were fitting attendees to the correct PFDs for their sizes, to the point of refusing to allow some to try a wrong fit. I only wish the boat reps exercized similar care when tossing folks into their demos.

Cheers.

Ah boat demo's... I am now on both sides and understand better what happens. At a demo a few weeks ago, I saw a rep try to dissuade a 10 year old from using trying out a 17.5' boat... really hard to do when Mummy and Daddy say nothing.

At the REI event, you get families show up for a "boat ride" - they have no intention of buying a boat, just looking for something for the family to do for free for the afternoon. Really frustrating as a rep to lose your boats like that for an afternoon instead of having potential customers in them. When it gets busy, customers just jump right in and don't even ask. That's how half the paddles end up upside down... The goal of the rep is to sell boats, not teach paddling at these events. This year though REI's format is changing a bit and they are offering mini skill sessions. So perhaps it will be a bit different this year.

Suz

[brwells]

We moved the recital to Tuesday June 10, with a dress on Sunday. So I probably WILL attend.

Ern

Great news, Ernie. We'll see you there.

They want us to be there by 9 AM, by the way.

Brian

[brwells]

Well, we have six of us going to this event. We still could use a couple more.

Last minute notes:

• We will all be given REI t-shirts, so please email me your sizes ASAP!!
• We need to be there at 9.
• the parking is a bit tight and REI wants to get as many "prospects" as possible in, so they are asking if we can car pool. I am bringing one of the other paddlers with me, if the rest can car pool at all, great. Also - we can meet in the REI Framingham store which is less than a mile away and car pool.

Also - NSPN hats to the participants.

[cathyfoley]

Well, we have six of us going to this event. We still could use a couple more.

Last minute notes:

• We will all be given REI t-shirts, so please email me your sizes ASAP!!
• We need to be there at 9.
• the parking is a bit tight and REI wants to get as many "prospects" as possible in, so they are asking if we can car pool. I am bringing one of the other paddlers with me, if the rest can car pool at all, great. Also - we can meet in the REI Framingham store which is less than a mile away and car pool.

Also - NSPN hats to the participants.

Hi Brian:

My schedule has changed and looks like I can help out. Not sure how an REI t-shirt fits over a PFD, but XXL. I don't think anyone else coming from NH, so unlikely I'm car pooling. Where should we meet?

[brwells]

Hi Brian:

My schedule has changed and looks like I can help out. Not sure how an REI t-shirt fits over a PFD, but XXL. I don't think anyone else coming from NH, so unlikely I'm car pooling. Where should we meet?

That's great, Kathy. I had the same thoughts about the shirts. Supposedly they say something like "REI Safety Paddler"; interesting if they are made of cotton.

There is nothing formal as to meeting before. I will have three with me car pooling and therefore I am going directly to the lake and will arrive just before 9. I know Galen will be at the REI store in Framingham (less than a mile from the lake) at 8:45 for anyone that wants to share a ride with him.

We are to tell the person at the gate that we are working with REI; that is supposed to let us park for free.

See you Sunday.

[hopefloats]

I will be bringing the Bin o' booth stuff, so I am imagining I will be driving straight to the lake too. The bin takes up my back seat, but I have a passenger seat available if anybody wants it. (I'll be starting from Malden)

I have a hullavator to transport said passenger's boat if needed as well.... or we could arrange the swapping of the bin instead...whatever works.

BTW - Brian, I gave you a shirt size via email, but - duh - I'll be in the booth, not a "safety paddler" so that may nix me needing a shirt unless they want the NSPN booth people to be visually REI "partners" as well or something.

[hopefloats]

Anybody got an address for the boat ramp area for google or map quest directions?

[jason]

Anybody got an address for the boat ramp area for google or map quest directions?

Please let me know if this is what you need:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&amp...0185534d291563d

Thanks -Jason

[subaruguru]

Hi Brian,

I can wear either an L or XL, but if it's cotton forget it.

Also hope they supply better pizza than last year, and maybe 20% coupons instead of those 15%-ers.

Carpool...with yaks? I'm probably bringing BOTH my Cetus and Force5...cause they're loaded, and will try to be there by 9.

See ya.

[subaruguru]

There's a large sign indicating Canoe & Kayak right on Rt 30.

I suggest that we wear our yellow NSPN hats if it's not too sunny. Will probably be more identifiable than a t-shirt under a PFD?

We have a bunch of these left, Brian, or just the newer ones?

[brwells]

There's a large sign indicating Canoe & Kayak right on Rt 30.

I suggest that we wear our yellow NSPN hats if it's not too sunny. Will probably be more identifiable than a t-shirt under a PFD?

We have a bunch of these left, Brian, or just the newer ones?

Yellow hats?? that's so retro. We will all have the new hats to wear and keep.

Just a last reminder to everyone: be at the park by 9, go to the REI store in Framingham if you want to car pool from there (Galen will be there at 8:45), and remember the sun block.

[brwells]

Thanks to Galen, Kathy, Gillian, Ernie, Heidi, Suwin, Michelle, and John (new member soon) we had a great but hot day helping REI at Lake Cochituate in Natick. Between putting out the marker buoys (nothing like carrying bricks in your kayak) to keeping people away from the motorboats that did not understand what "no wake" means, we had no capsizes, no rescues. Lots of upside down paddles, however, and all the rest you see with people new to paddlecraft. Nice to see Suz at the Kokotat display, also.

REI appreciated our help, and they certainly had better food this year.

Thanks again to everyone for your assistance.

[Kevin B (RPS Coach)]

Thanks to Galen, Kathy, Gillian, Ernie, Heidi, Suwin, Michelle, and John (new member soon) we had a great but hot day helping REI at Lake Cochituate in Natick. Between putting out the marker buoys (nothing like carrying bricks in your kayak) to keeping people away from the motorboats that did not understand what "no wake" means, we had no capsizes, no rescues. Lots of upside down paddles, however, and all the rest you see with people new to paddlecraft. Nice to see Suz at the Kokotat display, also.

REI appreciated our help, and they certainly had better food this year.

Thanks again to everyone for your assistance.

Quick note. I was cc'd on this email from the Outreach Coordinator at REI:

"Brian,

I just wanted to extend one more thanks to you and the NSPN paddlers who served as safety boaters for our demo this past Sunday. We greatly appreciate your support for this event. We look forward to working with your group again next year. Please do not hesitate to contact Joel or myself if you have any initiatives that would benefit from REI’s support. Also, prior to the paddle demo, we received authorization to register REI as an official member of the NSPN. In the chaos of this weekend, I did not get around to getting you the check. Please let me know where I can send this and I will forward it out to you.

Sincerely,

Dane Tullock

Outreach & Events"

Great job, Brian, in organizing our participation and a big thanks to all who sweltered on the water.

[subaruguru]

QUOTE(Kevin B @ Jun 10 2008, 12:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Quick note. I was cc'd on this email from the Outreach Coordinator at REI:

"Brian,

I just wanted to extend one more thanks to you and the NSPN paddlers who served as safety boaters for our demo this past Sunday. We greatly appreciate your support for this event. We look forward to working with your group again next year. Please do not hesitate to contact Joel or myself if you have any initiatives that would benefit from REI’s support. Also, prior to the paddle demo, we received authorization to register REI as an official member of the NSPN. In the chaos of this weekend, I did not get around to getting you the check. Please let me know where I can send this and I will forward it out to you.

Sincerely,

Dane Tullock

Outreach & Events"

Great job, Brian, in organizing our participation and a big thanks to all who sweltered on the water.

Hey Kev 'n Brian,

I'm the guy who suggested to Dane that they become a dues-paying member before soliciting our support! Glad this friendly not-so-blackmail is ok. But did they only cough up $25?

Yeah, keeping the newbies out of speedboats' wakes was a bit challenging, as well differentiating the CRCK renters who were free to play chicken with them. It'd be a good idea to either work out no-wake markers or maybe ask that CG attendee on the beach advising such; otherwise we may have to carry a ton of bricks next year to establish an outer boundary line, as it'd take a good 10-12 buoys to be effective.

The 13yr age minimum was helpful, but I still saw too many little folks struggling with 240cm aluminum paddles, as there weren't enough 220s to go around.

REI and its reps struggle to understand why the 300+ demos of last year's event produced so few follow-up sales. One of the reasons includes insufficient attention matching paddlers to craft (ESPECIALLY paddles), as well lack of sophistication in marketing techniques.

This year they did have a better assortment of kayaks, including the venerable Manitou14 for newbies and a couple of Elizas that truly pleased a few folks, but these were in the minority.

I didn't see as many

If the sub-$1500 rec industry wants to see greater yield from these quite wonderful demo days the sponsors will have to address fit and ergonomics with more attention than may be possible given the lack of trained staff available. Just getting someone PFD'd and floated with a paddle isn't going to sell the sport except to the self-motivated who put in the work to get fitted well and find a kayak best fitted to their needs on their own or through a dedicated paddling outfitter.

REI and similar outlets have pretty much given up on the pricier composite market, hoping to capitalize on the juicier yields of plastic rec boats. I'm sure they've studied this to death by now.

Yet the fact that I personally witnessed significant pleasurable surprise each time I suggested that a fairly stable newbie try out a sleeker craft...along with MY paddle for a minute or two indicated that the impulse purchase potential is GREATLY increased when a newbie demos an appropriate kayak with a lighter paddle.

At the very least REI should learn to provide the newer 2lb $125-200 Aquabounds and Werners for demo instead of $50 3+lb 240cm entry junk.

Otherwise too many first-day paddlers who unable to overcome poor ergonomics and inappropriate fit, and never buy their first kayak unless they either get lucky or have the motivation to pursue more qualified assistance at a dedicated shop.

Increasing yield isn't just about having us spotters adjust footpegs out on the water or flipping upside-down paddles. Unless trained shore staff has sufficient time to customize fit and application I'm afraid that yield levels may stay somewhat lower than hoped.

Just my two cents.

See ya next year.

[brwells]

Just my two cents.

See ya next year.

Ernie, you raise many good points, but you are really preaching to the choir by putting them here. Why not contact Dane directly and offer your advice and what your/our experiences have been like with both the REI days and similar demo programs. They might not be aware of what we all saw out on the water - after fitting a PFD and asking which kayak the person liked ("I want to try the red one!) they really did not witness that to which you refer.

My favorite part was the placing and retrieval of the buoys. Nothing like loading a nice glass kayak with bricks and a big orange ball.

[subaruguru]

Ernie, you raise many good points, but you are really preaching to the choir by putting them here. Why not contact Dane directly and offer your advice and what your/our experiences have been like with both the REI days and similar demo programs. They might not be aware of what we all saw out on the water - after fitting a PFD and asking which kayak the person liked ("I want to try the red one!) they really did not witness that to which you refer.

My favorite part was the placing and retrieval of the buoys. Nothing like loading a nice glass kayak with bricks and a big orange ball.

Hey Brian,

One of the consequences of my request to Dane to become a dues-paying member was to have them follow and join our threads, so i trust that they are. As well, I hope that other members chime in with advice for REI et al on how to develop and widen our sport responsibly and profitably.

My biggest remaining concern however is that because of a non-defined lane separating fast speedboaters and new kayakers I spent most of my energy fretting over creating safe passage instead of helping newbies with technique and gear tips.

Given that the buoys drifted all afternoon it would seem that a buoyed rope-line should be used next year to keep kayakers closer.

I still shake my head with bemusement that we portage'd bricks!

Ern