Paul Sylvester Posted October 12, 2019 Share Posted October 12, 2019 Calling all NH paddlers: This Wednesday there is a hearing on HB 640-FN. LOB room 307 at 9 am It will establish a fee and registration structure for NH residents who want to use a canoe or kayak. There are many reasons this is wrong for NH and a poorly thought out way to raise money. Please write or call your legislatures to try to kill this in committee. Sponsors are Goley and Hill and all contacts are on the NH website. We are low impact and most people that need SAR on the water are poorly equipped and have not taken the time to learn safety. This bill needs to die in committee. I am trying very hard to get free from work to go to the hearing. I have seven kayaks and a canoe. Some I might only use once a year. How many do you have? No idea what the provision is for out of state people. thanks, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted October 12, 2019 Share Posted October 12, 2019 Can you provide a link, Paul? I'll definitely get on it...again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Snyder Posted October 12, 2019 Share Posted October 12, 2019 (edited) I'm not sure I'm totally against this. We do use public launches and they're only proposing a $10 fee. https://legiscan.com/NH/text/HB640/id/1851772 https://www.nhstateparks.org/getmedia/9cbdb138-d582-40d4-b736-24b0322f2bab/HB-641-testimony-Campground-Fees-S-ELMA-(002)-(002).pdf Edited October 12, 2019 by Jim Snyder add links Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Sylvester Posted October 13, 2019 Author Share Posted October 13, 2019 12 hours ago, Brian Nystrom said: Can you provide a link, Paul? I'll definitely get on it...again. Brian, I am not good with web links. The state website is something like NHgencourtNHstate. https://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/house/committees/committeedetails.aspx?id=28 this should be the committee link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Sylvester Posted October 13, 2019 Author Share Posted October 13, 2019 11 hours ago, Jim Snyder said: I'm not sure I'm totally against this. We do use public launches and they're only proposing a $10 fee. https://legiscan.com/NH/text/HB640/id/1851772 https://www.nhstateparks.org/getmedia/9cbdb138-d582-40d4-b736-24b0322f2bab/HB-641-testimony-Campground-Fees-S-ELMA-(002)-(002).pdf Thanks Jim, I had not found the specifics of the bill and now that I have read it I have many concerns. I did not realize people who launch from private spots are exempt. That seems unfair to everyone that has to pay. When they get this $10.00 fee after they pay the agent 3.00 and the sticker cost then they have top allow for $106k reprogramming expense for state computers and maybe adding staff at local towns? They say .32 for stickers and I call BS on that. In my town the dump stickers are about ten times that cost to the town. I know because I heard the whole story from the transfer manager. So are they trying to set up a new Navigation safety fund? Stop and eradicate invasive plants? Build and maintain ramps? I am all for user fees at ramps and access fees but adding this is short sighted and not right. Why not have self pay kiosks at larger ramps where you self pay and put the paper on your dash? It would do the same thing and would work for trailered boats. The ideas behind these bills in NH have always been SAR expenses. But the vast majority of SAR money spent is on hiking and wilderness injuries. When it comes to watercraft injuries many are power related and the hand paddled craft problems are mostly launched from private spots. (IE: midnight after a few drinks) Every year I buy a couple of Hike Safe Cards to help out the NH Fish and Game revenues. Revenue is down from hunting and fishing and the state is having a hard time funding SAR and F & G. The fines for SAR are great but how many are actually charged? Why not start charging and ticketing everyone who parks along the highway at Lafayette and MT Major and many other trailheads? What about out of state paddlers who use a ramp? Not all ramps charge a fee so they would get a pass? There are better ways to get money out of people using existing systems without adding to state bureaucracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Snyder Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 Paul, I'm not arguing for it, I just wanted us to be well informed. The whole registration process has always baffled me a little. Why do I have to register my dogs but not my cats or horses? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Nystrom Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 This has been an ongoing battle for the better part of two decades. The real issue is that NH Fish and Game is not funded from the state's General Fund and they have huge pension costs that they can't support, so they're always looking for new revenue sources. I learned this directly from the Director of Fish and Game. Don't let the smokescreen about other uses fool you. The ultimate solution to their problem is not to tax paddlecraft users, it's to get the legislature to do the right thing for the agency. Fees on paddlecraft are misguided and will only serve to hurt tourism, which we can't afford. They're going to hire someone to administer the program for $59,000, which means that they would have to register 5900 canoes and kayaks just to cover the salary costs. Good luck with that! While it appears that this only applies to boats launched at public ramps and not beaches, it's a classic "slippery slope". Once they have a fee in place, it will be relatively easy for them to expand it's scope to include all paddlecraft, regardless of where they're launched. There is no doubt in my mind that this is exactly their strategy. They've never been able to pass full registration of paddlecraft, so they're going to try to nibble away at it, bit-by-bit. If they want to impose a launch fee at boat ramps or create a state "boat ramp access pass", that's fine, but there is no valid reason to register paddlecraft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Snyder Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 Here's info on the history of this topic and national implications: https://www.americanwhitewater.org/content/Wiki/stewardship:boater_registration Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eburgess Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 So for this fee do we get increased parking spots at launches? The local launches that I use have lots of trailered parking (many sit vacant) and four or five none trailered spots which are always filled. I am willing to pay if we get increased parking. I just found out about this today. I will be contacting my legislator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Sylvester Posted October 14, 2019 Author Share Posted October 14, 2019 7 hours ago, eburgess said: So for this fee do we get increased parking spots at launches? The local launches that I use have lots of trailered parking (many sit vacant) and four or five none trailered spots which are always filled. I am willing to pay if we get increased parking. I just found out about this today. I will be contacting my legislator. It does not call out anything specific for parking. Just general language. Agree and willing to pay for targeted services but this is not a good way to pay and this seems poorly thought out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill H Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 Back in 2006 my wife and I attended NH Fish and Game meeting for the same issue when we owned Seacoast Kayak. They invited us to come to the meeting for input. They were looking for new revenue sources to cover costs. I suggested that if we have to pay a fee we should have the same rights as boaters. At public boat launches create more parking for kayaks and less for boat trailers. I also suggested kayak only launch sites be put in. Most people went through the roof, this is when I realized they didn't care about kayaks and just needed more money. They never contacted us again. That was 13 years ago and I new the issue would be brought up again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Sylvester Posted October 19, 2019 Author Share Posted October 19, 2019 Thanks to some Merrimac Valley WW paddlers we have an update as I could not get to Concord Wednesday. The boat registration stickers part is gone (we think) and this has (somehow?) morphed into a voluntary user fee along the lines of the hike safe card. It will only apply to paddle craft at state owned or state maintained boat ramps or car top launches. It is supposed to be voluntary the first two years and is making up for fed funding losses. Don't believe it has anything to do with SAR. It was said the voluntary hike safe cards bring in a lot of money. Some years I have bought hike safe cards for myself and my kids at $25 per. Most hikers I know buy them to help the state. I have always been okay with user fees that are targeted and well managed so lets see where this goes? They want something that will pass the Governors desk so maybe...just maybe some two party systems are working? Next hearing is 11/5/19 at 10am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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